• Changes to NPCs, Quests, Spawns and AR.

    This thread is for feedback about the changes we made in the latest update that we are aware not everyone is universally happy with. We are (of course) happy to listen to constructive feedback and the changes are not set in stone.

    Previously, leather armor gave much less protection than chain, which gave much less protection that plate. Recently, the AR value of a leather breast and chain breast were increased to the same as a plate breast (20). This most recent update reduces the AR of a leather breast to 16, and a chainmail breast to 19. Of course this is more realistic, but there are other reasons for these changes. There needs to be a genuine choice between a RoP and Leather Armor for Clerics, Druids and Rogues. The fact that leather was so good meant that RoPs had low value, and leather is also much less colorful! Including hat, belt and boots, the AR in full leather is now 38, whereas in a fresh RoP it's 33, and an RoP with leather arms is 39. A fresh magical robe therefore provides a very slight AR advantage over the non-magical leather armor. Robes can of course also wear rings which will last them a long time, and there are more dragons for you to hunt with the latest update, some of them in relatively easy-to-access areas.

    It's worth pointing out that game-mechanically, there isn't much difference between AR of 38 and 42. There is a huge game-mechanical difference between AR of 88 and 92 though, so the one-point drop to chainmail breast is actually significant! We are aware that several plates have BS 12, and can craft GM chain breasts and the rest of their armor is GM plate. There are a couple of high level plates able to craft full GM plate, which requires BS 16, a sixteen-fold higher investment of time and resources. It's simply unfair for this not to make any difference! Plates with BS12 will have the choice between the durable GM chainmail or the slightly higher AR plate. Plates with BS 16.... well you deserve superhuman armor!

    Purple eggs are ubiquitous due to many high level fighters being at various times practically addicted to sea-serpents, as well as egg-hunting at Easter. We previously increased the requirement to 24 eggs, but even so RoLBs were far too common. We are however aware that some people have stockpiled purple eggs, and we are considering ways to make sure people to get fair value from their eggs. At some point soon, there will be a new purple egg quest. You can still hunt tuskers for RoLBs.
    Previously useless items such as BM staves, Rust Glands and Harpie Beaks now give some quite pleasant rewards, and some less useful quest rewards have been changed to give some nice items, so the overall balance of quest changes actually makes the game slightly easier.

    We increased the Tusker spawn so that hunting for RoLBs is feasible if you have a party that can cope with Marali forest.
    We increased the Forest Troll spawn because it was boring down there!
    We removed the Sand Spiders from the area near the new Andris Port for IC reasons, and we have no fewer than four new areas with Sand Spiders to hunt (as well as poison island, Mirith Poison island, and the Tower).
    We reduced or completely removed several spawns for tedious or non-hostile creatures because the server was complaining about all the thousands of Hell Mages, Liches, Golems and Dragons with which we have stuffed every inch of the new dungeons.

    We added new NPCs (for example to the Port), and we were obliged to remove a few. The Andris greeter Nusbalm served very little purpose as demos seldom come to Andris, and if they do they don't usually find Nusbalm. We also wanted each city to have reasons that will get people to visit from time to time, and wanted Lerilin to be the only place to trade fangs for ash. For the same reason, the Mirith greeter will not be replaced. Duvalle knows all the gossip, (except that we found out he doesn't know about Delimew or Terra, this was a mistake we will shortly correct).

    Overall effect on the game.
    We are aware that some people think the changes to AR in particular represent the GMs deliberately making the game more difficult. This isn't the case. Firstly, the changes to AR make much, much less difference than you think, (unless you were a fighter who wore a leather breast that could be crafted on the move, thereby giving part of your armor effectively infinite durability!). Secondly, the recent changes to the way you gain successes from fighting a wider spread of creatures have made it much easier as well as more enjoyable to level up. Thirdly, and most importantly, it's much easier to hunt with friends. There are many, many more players around exploring all the new areas, so it should be much easier now to organize a fun party!

    Feel free to argue different cases below. We are listening!

    Nanuht and Cyzna

  • I might have an egg or two to turn in i look foward to seeing the new purple egg quest when its discovered or added. thanks again for the update its refeshing seeing people out hunting again.


  • Great update! I really like exploring the new areas, I can honestly say I have been scared running around the caves not knowing what to expect. I think the dungeons are very well designed and all feel fresh. Thanks for all the effort GM team, I appreciate it.

    I also thought the leveling change was genius, I love on bert not being concerned with what level creature I am attacking. To be honest it has made me a better player since I am more willing to hunt in easier areas with newer people, and attack what I need to attack instead of what will level my special lol.

    Speaking as a cleric of course I would like my 4 AR back, however I do realize that the issue involved more than just clerics. I have been a large proponent of the cleric class both ingame and on the forums. If I was going to change something it would be that I don't want to be a 100% healer on every hunt. Yes, some hunts require a 100% healer, and I don't mind being the traditional healer on those hunts. But if I am just running around the woods with a couple of people, a 100% dedicated healer is not needed and leaves me bored. Having an option to reduce healing power in order to do a little damage would be nice. I realize that clerics are extremely hard to balance. It can be very tough at lower levels for a cleric, but once the cleric gets higher they become a truly versatile character. It would be easy to accidently make higher level clerics overpowered.

    Thanks again smile

  • I quite like the fact that spawns have become more localized (sand spiders, increase of tuskers), because it means more travelling instead of sitting in one city, getting all we need just in front of its doors. (Yes, I am guilty of that often myself).

    With the AR, ah who wouldn't want them back, but on the good side: a robe gives more than the leather, which I think makes more sense. (and looks better, too)

    As for the new areas: Wow! I haven't seen half of them yet, but looking forward to the exploring and excitement of discovering.

  • I can't seem to edit my post so an add on here: The one thing I'm not so keen about (don't kill me, Iceane), is the new brown as hair color. It just doesn't look brown.

  • To clarify something about RoLBs.

    There were four quests for them, plus the occasional events such as the Easter quests. We've removed one, based on the conviction that SS became far too easy to farm and RoLBs were becoming as common as ginseng, requiring 1h of playing per ring.

    On the other hand, we keep giving them away in RTQs, and we have added them to the occasional spawn of some chests. You can still get them at the Silver Leaf Shop, but that's another story.

    It is also an item that can be crafted, and we have made crafting materials easier to reach than ever because we think that enchanting should have some use. It is not really fair to think that we've made it impossible for people to get them. wink

    We do think, however, that RoLBs, just like the other magic rings, are emergency items, ideally relatively rare and to be used now and then, when someone crashes, or when the cleric is cursed, for example. Out of the magic rings, RoLBs and RoRCs were the most common, with RoLBs having the advantage of being possible to get in several different ways, rather than GM spawned brigands.

    And since we're at this: the quest for the RoLH is not gone. It just changed.

  • We are aware that some people think the changes to AR in particular represent the GMs deliberately making the game more difficult. This isn't the case. Firstly, the changes to AR make much, much less difference than you think there isn't much difference between AR of 38 and 42


    So why make these changes then and make (quite a bit more than just "some") unhappy? It certainly doesn't create a genuine choice between a RoP and Leather Armor for Clerics, Druids and Rogues.

  • Having a leather breastplate with the same armor rating as a plate breast (20) was a temporary experiment that didn't really work. All we have done is change this back to something more realistic (actually I think it was 15 before, so it's still better now at 16!). We also wanted to strike a balance where wearing a good RoP was better than non-magical armor, but non-magical armor (leather) is a viable alternative for those wanting to conserve robes.

  • What didn't work about it? I mean are you now saying that the matter of 4 AR did make a difference? Perhaps an alternative solution might have been to make the plate breast slightly higher therefore more realistic. After all, it wouldn't make that much difference now would it.

  • The problem is that AR makes a big game mechanical difference at high armor ratings, and a small difference at low armor ratings, so giving a higher AR to plate breast would make plates overpowered.

    The intention behind the increase in AR of leather breast was to get rogues to use leather armor and stop tanking stuff in full plate. Approximately, the idea was that fighters would wear plate, rangers would wear chain, rogues would wear leather, druids and clerics RoPs plus leather arms and wizards would use RoP only.

    I know... I know... but now at least you can see why the experiment was classed as a failure!

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